I’m afraid I have to go back to the MSZP-DK negotiations because some of the coverage of MSZP’s reactions is far too sketchy. MTI, which serves all Hungarian news organizations, first reported that MSZP found “three of DK’s nine-point suggestions unacceptable.” They are unacceptable because they suggest a renegotiation of the agreement between MSZP and Együtt 2014-PM. MSZP also found it worrisome that DK offers only “an election alliance while the socialists and Együtt 2014-PM agreed to a political alliance.”
Since not too many publications bothered to reprint DK’s nine-point proposal, which is available on DK’s webpage, I’m going to list the points here. Some of the more important passages are quoted verbatim. Others are only summarized.
(1) DK’s ideal arrangement would still be naming a common prime minister and having only one common party list. Therefore “we suggest holding out the possibility of coming to a possible understanding on these issues.”
(2) “We recognize the validity of the MSZP-Együtt 2014 agreement. Although at present we are negotiating only with MSZP, we want to adhere to the MSZP-Együtt-PM agreement and we would like to apply the principles and their consequences to the agreement as a whole.”
(3) “The Demokratikus Koalíció is interested in the success of the negotiations and to this end the Party is ready to give up its right to form its own list and put up individual candidates.”
(4) “The desired agreement aims at concluding not a political but an electoral alliance…. From here on parties of the electoral alliance … will represent their own politics independently.”
(5) “It is our aim to have a common MSZP-DK list and to have common individual candidates.”
(6) DK believes in proportional representation when it comes to the individual candidates of the 106 electoral districts. MSZP and Együtt 2014 together have 1.4-1.6 million voters, DK has 100-200,000.
(7) Each party will have the right to name its own preferred candidates in the individual districts as well as on the lists.
(8) According to the unbroken Hungarian custom, “the largest party, i.e. MSZP, has the right to name the first person on the list and the smaller party, i.e. DK, will be able to name someone for the second place.”
(9) The two parties will prepare jointly for the election, they will name a team together and will jointly finance the campaign.
Even before the official word came from MSZP headquarters Magyar Hírlap learned from socialist sources that “MSZP is no longer interested in Gyurcsány.” According to the paper, MSZP politicians believe that leaving DK out of the agreement is more beneficial to MSZP because, according to polls ordered by the party, MSZP will receive twice as many votes without DK than with DK support. The paper took it for granted that as a result of MSZP’s refusal Ferenc Gyurcsány’s party will enter the race alone.
This doesn’t seem to be the case, however. As of this moment we still don’t know which three points are unacceptable to MSZP. In addition to these three unnamed points MSZP, which originally sided with DK on voting rights for ethnic Hungarians living in neighboring countries, by now has changed its mind, most likely as a result of pressure from Együtt-2014-PM. Now MSZP insists on DK’s acceptance of this Fidesz-introduced law which in fact is unpopular among people in Hungary proper. MSZP also wants to have an answer about DK’s position on a tuition-free first year of college.
It would seem on first blush that there is no reason to think that there will be an agreement between these two parties. But MSZP didn’t close the door. The talks continued, after which Gyurcsány seemed optimistic. He claimed that “we got one step closer to an accord” and expressed his hope that a final agreement will be reached within days. Gyurcsány said that DK doesn’t want to reopen the negotiations, stressing that its nine-point proposal didn’t contain such a demand. He also indicated that DK accepts all of the policy concepts on which MSZP and E14 agreed. I assume that means DK’s abandonment of its strongly held view on ethnic Hungarian voting rights.
Gyurcsány found it especially heartwarming that MSZP didn’t raise objections to DK’s proposals for a common list and common candidates. He added that there was no MSZP criticism of DK’s ideas on proportionality. According to him, MSZP simply indicated that they don’t want to extend that principle to Együtt 2014-PM because MSZP had already closed those negotiations.
Last Sunday MSZP-DK-Együtt 2014 logos together resulted a large victory for the candidate in the by-election in Szigetszentmiklós
If Gyurcsány’s understanding of the conversation with the MSZP leadership is correct, this would mean that DK would have the right to name its own candidates in 7 or 8 districts. In the 75 districts to which MSZP is currently entitled, all candidates would run under the MSZP-DK logos. And on the list DK politicians would receive about 10% of the places.
Perhaps Gyurcsány is overly optimistic, but if his description of the situation is correct, DK is not as badly off as I thought only a few hours ago. I still have some doubts, however. What if MSZP insists on leaving Gyurcsány off the list? There is no way that DK will ever accept that demand. What will Együtt 2014-PM think if DK’s logo appears alongside MSZP’s red carnation? Or perhaps Gyurcsány’s reference to “common candidates” doesn’t mean that they would run under MSZP and DK logos. In brief, there are still many questions. But within a few days we ought to know more.
Hungarian Spectrum 
So, we have a situation where Gyurcsany, as MSZP prime minister in 2006, governs so poorly that the streets of Budapest break out in riots and the MSZP descends into a black hole of unpopularity. The MSZP, in its infinite wisdom, votes confidence in Gyurcsany and elevates him to the post of party president in 2007.
By 2009, even the least intelligent Socialists realize that it’s time to dump Gyurcsany. But by then, it was too late — Gyurcsany and his allies had already created the situation that allowed Fidesz to win a two-thirds majority and turn Hungary into a virtual monocracy. In the 2010 elections, the Socialists post their worst showing since 1990.
Following this drubbing, things get ever more tense between the ex-PM and the party he once led. Then, in 2011, the Gyurcsany and nine other rebels desert the MSZP’s parliamentary caucus to form the Democratic Coalition. This diminishes the Socialists’ power in parliament and quite nearly makes Jobbik the second-biggest caucus.
Now, Gyurcsany — one of the least popular politicians in the country — wants to make nice with the Socialists and run common candidates.
If Mesterhazy accepts that deal, he should go out in the backyard and shoot himself in the head. It wouldn’t hurt him, because he wouldn’t have any brains, anyway.
Re Seal Driver. In my opinion this is a far too simplified and most likely untrue description what happened before and after 2006. This is the simple Fidesz story: everything is Gyurcsány’s fault. One ought to be a bit more sophisticated politically. Life is never that simple.
For your information, the riots of 2006 has nothing to do with Gyurcsany’s governance – as the population concerned, – it was all about how a couple of MSZP old-timers managed to give enough ammunition to Fidesz to start up that memorable campaign.
In my opinion the “incriminating” speech so far the most honest statements of recent history – but, of course, your’e free to interpret the same way as all the orbanist horde, I have no objection.
However, anyone even with a half brain should realize, that there is no way around DK, neither of the other even smaller players, if there really is some intention to send away this megalomaniac bunch of inadequate morons who happens to govern presently.
Then comes up the rather obvious question too: why would anyone vote rather to – say P. Juhász -than Gyurcsány?
What merits prove him more suitable?
As I see it, if there is a serious will to change this dreadful gang with their moth-eaten ideology, then we should stop liking or disliking politicians – it shouldn’t really matter, you see, as long as they do what they are there for – and treat things in a rather pragmatical manner.
Then, and only then would we stand a chance to defeat Orban and his cronies.
But, of course, if we want that happen at all.
Otherwise you’re quite right, if we want to go on a few more decades as this.. .
It doesn’t doesn’t matter what the truth is. Seal’s post shows exactly why we should stay away from Gyurcsany. Because the majority of the country agrees with Seal. Left and right.
Gyurcsany is bad juju. Nobody wants the Gyurcsany party. My heart breaks, but we need votes in 2014 not the Dk.
Enough of this nonsense. Game over.
For the opposition winning will rely on two specific policies:
One, the vote in 2014 should be considered a referendum on staying or leaving the EU since Orban is so obviously maneuvering the ship of state out of the Union.
Two, opposition list members, led by Bajnai and Mesterhazy, should commit to a Probity Clause that will have stringent rules
and penalties for fraudulent conduct by elected members.
Let each ‘list’ member sign such a document and, at every occasion, wave it in the face of Fidesz members they oppose…to outline those same Fidesz members wrong doings and how they should’ve suffered legally…
September 4
Viviane Reding is now satisfied with Orban’s dictatorship. Shame on the EU.
“After many exchanges, Hungary has respected the legal views of the
Commission and has brought its constitution back in line with EU law
with regard to all the points raised by the Commission. Hungary has respected –
as the rule of law requires – the judgement of the Court of Justice of November
last year which confirmed the Commission’s view that the anticipated mandatory
retirement of 10% of the Hungarian judiciary was not in line with EU law.
President Barroso and I were intensely involved in bringing all these matters
to a satisfying conclusion from a legal perspective.”
Viviane Reding – The EU and the Rule of Law – What next?
http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_SPEECH-13-677_en.htm?locale=en
—————————-
March 25
Mrs Tunde Szajer nee Hando
We sent 231 judges into early retirement.
From these judges, 164 judges started a lawsuit against the Hungarian government.
From this number, 50 judges were reinstated.
hvg.hu/itthon/20130325_Hando_231_birot_kuldtunk_nyugdijba_tavaly
——————-
Does anyone know the updated number of the reinstated judges?
The fact is that this is not really the case. Of course, this is what Fidesz voters think but supporters of the opposition parties are not at all that antagonistic toward Gyurcsány. In fact, for the majority it makes no difference whether he is in or out of the alliance.
You remember when Medián came out with a poll that inquired about popularity of Mesterházy versus Bajnai and once Medián discarded the Fidesz voters and counted only people who would vote for the opposition, Bajnai’s popularity became much greater than that of Mesterházy. I understand that the situation is very much the same when it comes to opinion on Gyurcsány. Once you discard Fidesz voters, his unpopularity is nothing like what an ordinary popularity polls suggest.
The “National” Election Commission will be formed in September.
The Fidesz Parlament will elect 7 members and 3 substitute members for 9 years.
The parliamentary factions that are recognized by Fidesz [!] can add 1 delegate each, i.e. DK and E14 will NOT be represented in the Commission.
In my counting, we shall have
9 Fidesz-KDNP members
1 Jobbik
1 MSzP
1 LMP members at the end of the month, i.e.
a preprogrammed 3/4 Fidesz super-majority.
The Election Commission will have wide powers rejecting demands for referendums, rejecting claims of fraud, declaring the winners in the elections.
http://www.jogiforum.hu/hirek/30291
During the recent week or two I keep wondering about a couple of question nobody seem eager to clarify. I hope, the learned participants of this blog might.
– When ever the name of Mesterházy comes up as a possible PM candidate, nearly always I hear: nay, he’s to young, still got time, and anyway, has no experience at all, but over all: power-hungry..!
Well, just how much older Orbán was in ’98?
How much more political experience Bajnai has got at the time he became PM? (There always a first time, and all this crap, but still..!)
If he wasn’t interested about the power what comes with the job, why would he be there at all?
Bringing back MSZP from near extinction proves some skills to me. How about it?
– When ever the name of Gyurcsány comes up at all, but particularly as a leader of a party, – which is in my opinion the only contemporary, modern political entity in Hungary, but never mind tis – there is always the remark: he should withdraw from politics, since he is unpopular, and anyway, he has “done bad things, even lied, day and night…”, so why does he still trying to hold on?
Just what he really did lie about, anybody? (I know, I’ve asked the same question a couple of times already, but still no answer. Maybe this time?)
Even if there is no proof of his lies and wrongdoings, he should stand back and disappear.
Why?
If I – or anybody for that matter – start to spread rumors about you, that your’e a liar, a thief and even a child molester, you would really rather resign and go in hiding for good, because this is the proper behavior? Are you serious?
So far none of the accusations stuck on Gyurcsány, and not because of lack of trying.
So?
– Only Bajnai the right candidate for Premier, and the E14 the the only party which isn’t tainted yet..!
Well, while Bajnai really is a talented person and has proved himself as an excellent manager – even in a state-level – in my opinion he isn’t politician (enough).
Let alone the E14, with quite a number of nice people with very little – the former LMP – or practically zero experience in politics, with rather modest organization at their disposal, so, they really are, what the country need in this times?
Being innocent is valued only in certain special circumstances by some, when no practical experience is desired for some unknown reason, but this isn’t the time for trying, I guess.
I would honestly appreciate meaningful answers, preferably not emotionally indicated ones, if I may.
Thanks in advance.
Its not just Fidesz voters and opposition voters. Thats not enough. We need to win some of the disappointed right and of course the undecided.
There is another thing besides the elections. Imagine we won and the government has build public support. What if he does the same. Tries to blackmail the new government. The DK “will stand by its opinion” unless they get a ministry. Sounds familiar?
One more question, and a rather important one: does anyone heard anything of the ideological basis of the E14 as a party?
I’ve heard a few, rather fuzzy statements here and there, but these are mostly messy, inconsistent and rather populist.
Of course, it may have exist and I may have missed – and I apologize for my ignorance – nevertheless, would be nice to know, which way they’ll turn if the time comes.
Mutt, DK isn’t only Gyurcsány, and yes, there is quite a few people whom I rather see in the velvet chair from them than P.Juhász.
Don’t you?
Spectator, its not me. I like Gyurcsany. But he starts buzzing around the government after an anti-fidesz win, the Fidesz will constantly be playing the Gyurcsany card. 2006 will repeat itself. At least the brainwash part. Gyurcsany just had this loser aura …
Regarding Juhasz. I trust Bajnai that he would be able to manage Juhasz or dump him if needed. Gyurcsany is unmanageable.
The fact is, I personally like Gyurcsany. A close personal friend of mine is a founding member of DK.
I think Gyurcsany should have resigned in 2006 because his position had become untenable, no matter what the good intentions behind his Oszodi speech, and Fidesz’s deliberate, immoral misrepresentation thereof.
My post was intended to summarize how the public would perceive a kiss-and-make-up session between Gyurcsany and the MSZP.
Mostly I agree with you, but compared with the E14, but even with MSZP the DK has the most brain-power per square meter, I am positive.
Otherwise I heard Gyurcsány a couple of times consequently declaring that he don’t want to be a PM, he even recommended and supported Bajnai as long as he and his party were treated fairly.
However, the DK is there, and without them there is no chance to get anywhere.
Another day I’ve heard of a DK supporter saying, that they indeed vote to an E14 candidate if it was the interest of the united opposition, but he would be reluctant to vote for MSZP – even of the same reason – because he thought the E14 is much closer to his view.
Which means, it’s a mistake to freeze out Gyurcsány and his party, they should be integrated somehow instead of antagonizing them.
There must be a way or there is no way at all – from here where I sit right now .
The fact is that this is not really the case. Of course, this is what Fidesz voters think but supporters of the opposition parties are not at all that antagonistic toward Gyurcsány. In fact, for the majority it makes no difference whether he is in or out of the alliance.
You remember when Medián came out with a poll that inquired about popularity of Mesterházy versus Bajnai and once Medián discarded the Fidesz voters and counted only people who would vote for the opposition, Bajnai’s popularity became much greater than that of Mesterházy. I understand that the situation is very much the same when it comes to opinion on Gyurcsány. Once you discard Fidesz voters, his unpopularity is nothing like what an ordinary popularity polls suggest.
I have never seen a poll that measured Gyurcsany’s view among opposition voters only. However, I fear it is irrelevant, because the current crop of opposition voters is not going to be able to defeat Fidesz.
The opposition needs to break into that 50% of voters who currently have no faith in any party. And I assure you, Gyurcsany — or, as you correctly state, his inability to redress Fidesz’s 2006 “liar” accusations — is one of the primary reasons these people became disaffected in the first place.
Sorry, the formatting got messed up on the previous reply. I wrote:
I have never seen a poll that measured Gyurcsany’s view among opposition voters only. However, I fear it is irrelevant, because the current crop of opposition voters is not going to be able to defeat Fidesz.
The opposition needs to break into that 50% of voters who currently have no faith in any party. And I assure you, Gyurcsany — or, as you correctly state, his inability to redress Fidesz’s 2006 “liar” accusations — is one of the primary reasons these people became disaffected in the first place.
It is useless to listen to the Fidesz members and supporters.
Delusion is not their worst features.
Orban and co. deceived and betrayed Hungary and Europe.
The wise patriots know this, and some of them are not afraid to admit it.
Janos Gyurgyak, Attila Jakab, Csaba Fazekas, Tibor Meray, Laszlo Bartus……
Strong people are needed in the EU leadership.
The leadership must display characters like Churchilll’s.
Viviane Redings do not need to apply, who hardly qualifies to run a McDonalds’.
Viviane Reding backtrack….the long reach of the Azeri caper…
2013Braves, Petofi:
Reading, like all EU burocrats is nothing more than a sorry clown with zero powers.
She and her advisers and well-fed colleagues are no match to tough Eastern Europeans like Orbán and his minions.
If this goes on for long, even János Lázár will eat the eurocrats for breakfast. (The Americans always sell everything to the EU whether it’s “cloud computing” in the name of progress or GMO, they know that the EU can be sold anything if one is aggressive enough).
Like it was said, Orban backtracks in absolutely minimal places (but gets even tougher at other issues) and then he can sell it to Reading as a nice compromise. Reading will be happy, she can also claim victory and deal with other issues. The best part is that Orban can go around and boast about his savvyness and tell everybody that the EU is just a bunch of pushovers (well, true, I am afraid).
But the EU will never have tough leaders, because it is the last thing UK, France or Germany want.
The EU will only have clowns like the lady with foreign relation portfolio or the Belgian with that I don’t know what kind of powers or portfolio.
I would like to write to Ms Reding, but I am not able to find her e-mail address.
Does anyone know it?
http://ec.europa.eu/commission_2010-2014/reding/contact/index_en.htm
Reding’s contact details. You can also sent an e-mail to her spokeswoman:
http://ec.europa.eu/commission_2010-2014/reding/contact/index_en.htm
Mina Andreeva
Phone (+32-2) 299.13.82
Fax (+32-2) 296.07.46
Email: Mina.Andreeva@ec.europa.eu
Ms Reding does not support the establishment of a special monitoring mechanism for Hungary as envisioned in the Tavares report.
http://bruxinfo.hu/cikk/20130904-reding-nem-lat-lehetoseget-a-kulon-magyar-monitoringra.html
Sorry to say but this is what the voting masses remember and this is their level of sofistication. By all accounts, fair or not, you have to agree that Fidesz was successful in taking down Gy. The question is remains, why was Gy unable to prevent it or fright back in a way that the unsophisticated masses could identify with him. So yes, he did lead the country into a 2/3rds majority and the mess that came with it.
Totally OT (sorry), but I happened to catch a little bit of the Ferencváros-Sopron football game on TV last night, played at Puskás Stadium, and NOBODY was in the stands watching. It was so bizarre. I checked Nemzeti Sport this morning and they reported that 400 people were in the stadion. 400! Even the average American high school football team can get more than that to watch one of their games, if I understand correctly.
Puskás holds 68 976 people according to Wikipedia, so the venue was 0.6% full. (400 is also 0.02% of the population of Budapest). Moreover, we had nice weather outside, perfect for watching a sports game.
I realise that Sopron is second division, but isn’t Fradi the most popular team in the country or something? Why do we keep throwing money at this sport with such small support? I wonder if Hungary keeps building larger football stadiums, the result is that it will seem that they will appear even less full than before.
Sometime one has to realize that perception IS reality.
By failing to take that into consideration one is merely deluding him/herself and taking dreams for reality.
Good or bad, it is a fact that Gy has been discredited. It is irrelevant at this stage to argue whether the discredit is merited or not (although one may question the political wisdom of delivering “that” speech). To move forward towards a goal, one has to take into account the facts on the ground (or on the battlefield) as they are and not as they should be or wished to be.
Mutt, the problem is that those who truly belong to the right will never vote for MSZP-E14. Never, believe me. Those who voted for Fidesz in 2010 because they were disappointed and hope for wonderful things to come will vote for the left for which they voted before. So, all that courting of the “disappointed right” is hogwash. In my opinion.
I think that if you asked Bajnai his honest opinion it would be very close to that of Gyurcsány. The rest? It’s a mess. Milla with its fuzzy politics by the people directly: citizens order and politicians deliver. PM belonged to LMP which has very far to the left and have naive ideas about “green politics.” So, in my opinion it is mess.
I bet that even if Gyurcsány would disappear today the Gyurcsány bashing would continue. You know, in case he returns. Moreover, Bajnai’s former association with Gy. cannot be wiped clean. The whole “gyurcsányozas” will continue. Non-Hungarian speakers, note the similarity in grammatical construction between gyurcsányozás and zsidózás.
Re Buddy’s story about the 400 spectators. You all know that I know nothing about football and I have no interest in it. In fact, I have a certain disdain for the sport. But I’m getting hooked. Motivation? Schadenfreude. 😀 I pick up stories like: Orbán’s son was moved into a team which plays in the third division. Or whatever it is called. The bottom. He has to be pretty bad.
Mutt:
No right winger will ever vote for anybody in any way connectable to “communists” or “liberals”. (Any Heti Válasz and Magyar Nemzet is pretty good to connect anybody to “communist” and “liberals”.)
MSZP or Bajnai are a complete no-go for conservatives or right wingers.
If they are really fed up with Fidesz then they will still split the votes (the party list and the district ballots) between Fidesz and Jobbik or LMP and Fidesz etc. in some fashion. But they will never ever vote for Bajnai or Mesterházy, let alone Gyurcsány. Prof. Balogh is spot on.
This is a fundamental rule of the Hungarian political landscape.
Note, that no Hungarian conservative or right-winger (even supposed “liberals” like Gyuri Such is now a sort of chief of staff for Laci Kövér, we know how tough the perennial “liberal” Pokorni has been, let alone Jóska Szájer, hah, foreign smartasses and diplomats always counted him as a “liberal”) ever up to and including now has openly criticized Orbán. And they will never do so. Loyalty and the command to endure no matter whatare so important on the conservative side that you have no idea.
MSZP and Együtt and DK may get however most of the middle 1/3 (and their own voters). The middle 1/3 (or perhaps only 1/4, 1/5 nobody knows for sure) consist of independents who vote sometimes for the left, sometimes for the right, sometimes for LMP etc. they are not loyal to any party or ideology. The self identified leftist/liberals and the “independents” in theory are enough, however, to win or even to win 2/3s (although note that a 2/3 Fidesz is not equivalent to a joint DK/MSZP/Bajnai 2/3s for a bunch of reasons, partly because the left will never dare to live with its power, they are too timid, only Gyurcsány is tough enough, but his portion will be small).
Agree. Even if Gyurcsány left now the “gyurcsányozás” (Gyurcsány bashing) would still continue forever since there would still be people formerly associated with Gyurcsány (worked in state administration during his government and so on.) and by virtue of some association they are also like Gyurcsány which means they should be made to disappear.
You don’t need living Jews for anti-semitism to exist. These are not rational discourses.
The norm of Hungarian business thinking is, typically, pie-in-the-sky variety. To explain as it pertains to football (soccer): Hungarians note the monster fees being paid of a talented soccer player. The record was set recently for a Britisher at something like 130 million euros. Now that’s for one player. Hungarian players have transferred for considerably less–maybe 2/3 million euros–but even that is hefty profit. Try and achieve that every two or three years and you’ve got a monstrously successful business with minimum effort–a favorite of Hungarians (that is, the ‘minimum effort’).
And this explains why MSzP got trounced in the last elections?
Please, understand that there were two reasons for the unpopularity of the government between 2006 and 2010. Neither of them had much to do with Gyurcsány per se. One was that those reforms the government tried to introduce were unpopular: tuition, co-pay, etc. The other was the 2008 crash. It wouldn’t have mattered who the prime minister was the popularity of the government immediately dropped once the austerity package was introduced. And that package had to be introduced. This is what the whole speech in Őszöd was all about. Otherwise Hungary was facing very serious financial problems.
The austerity measures worked by mid-2008. The deficit was just over 4%. Now we tend to remember that the government’s unpopularity was so high that no wonder that people went on the streets. But if you take a look at the opinion polls of the time one is surprised to find that the government was still relatively popular. In the entire population in June 2006 MSZP stood at 28% and by December 2006 their support dropped only to 22%. Although during 2007 and 2008 they lost some support but the bottom fell out only after the financial crisis hit Hungary.
So, talking about the bad governance for which Gyurcsány was alone responsible doesn’t make much sense to me. Some people claim that he should have introduced the austerity program right after he became prime minister in 2004. However, that would have meant of having Orbán as prime minister already in 2006. Yes, I know, the answer is: “but he wouldn’t have had 2/3 majority.” Maybe not. But believe me the 1998-2002 Orbán period was no picnic either. Hungary was just as isolated as it is now. Orbán would have started his freedom fight with the European Union then and in this context the 2/3 majority would have made much of a difference.
OT: I hope you all recall that under the Gyurcsany government there were some great negotiation happening that were either cut short when Orban came to power or taken full credit of by Fidesz that had nothing to do with it. The Mercedes factory in Kecskemet was negotiated by the Gyurcsany government, and thanks to them they created hundreds of new and real jobs for real money (versus Orban who claims that forced labour and working outside the country is job creation). Lately Orban and his troopers do everything in their power to undermine Hungary’s reputation as a good political and business partner. No wonder that Mercedes is rethinking its expansion strategy in Hungary, and started to look further to invest. Gyurcsany built and negotiated, Orban destroys and burns bridges. Any Hungarian who would vote for this underqualified Fidesz gang fully deserves what comes in their way (further unemployment, more taxes and fees, and isolation from other European countries.
BREAKING
Workers are repaving the backroads leading to the venue of the Hungarian Royal Wedding. The bride is Rachel Orban, the daughter of His Majesty, Orban The 5th.
These roads were ignored for years, there were full of potholes. The work is funded by the taxpayers of course, not the Orbans. According to the locals, this is needed because of upcoming “high society event”.
The Dear Leader cannot be disappointed.
By the way the groom, Mr Tiborcz, a twenty something very talented young fella. He is already on the managing boards of several lucrative companies.
Let me quote another famous Tiborc for the Hungarian readers:
“Ő csorda számra tartja gyűlevész
szolgáit, éppenséggel mintha minden
hajszála egy őrzőt kivánna; sok
meránit, ollykor azt hinné az ember,
hogy tán akasztani viszik, úgy körül
van véve a léhűtőktől; s mi egy
rossz csőszt alig tudunk heten fogadni.
Ő táncmulatságokat ád szűntelen,
úgy, mintha mindég vagy lakadalma, vagy
keresztelője volna: és nekünk
szivünk dobog, ha egy csaplárlegény az
utcán előnkbe bukkanik, mivelhogy
a tartozás mindjárt eszünkbe jut.
A jó merániak legszebb lovon
ficánkolódnak, – tegnap egy kesely,
ma szürke, holnap egy fakó: – nekünk
feleség s porontyainkat kell befogni,
ha veszni éhen nem kívánkozunk.
Ők játszanak, zabálnak szűntelen,
úgy, mintha mindenik tagocska bennek
egy-egy gyomorral volna áldva: nékünk
kéményeinkről elpusztúlnak a
gólyák, mivel magunk emésztjük el
a hulladékot is. Szép földeinkből
vadászni berkeket csinálnak, a-
hová nekünk belépni sem szabad;
s ha egy beteg feleség, vagy egy szegény
himlős gyerek megkívánván, lesujtunk
egy rossz galambfiat, tüstént kikötnek;
és aki száz meg százezert rabol,
bírája lészen annak, akit a
szükség garast rabolni kénszerített.”
The situation is NOT hopeless.
1.
In the local by-election the other day, as I mentioned,
MSzP lost 9% of the votes vs 2010, while Fidesz lost 27%.
That was enough for the MSzP candidate to win that district.
2.
One of Fidesz’s pollsters, Szazadveg came out with new numbers.
Its headlines proclaimed inevitable Fidesz victory, of course.
But let us crunch the numbers.
Fidesz 27%
Jobbik 7%
other parties [democratic opposition] 22%
uncertain [or no answer] 44%
One can safely assume that not too many fideszniks did not answer their
inclination for the party to Szazadveg.
If the democratic opposition can inspire half of the uncommitted or hiding voters
to go to the booths in 2014, then we could have the following result.
Democratic opposition 44%
Fidesz 34% [with 7% imported Transylvanian votes]
Jobbik 7%
Does not vote 22%
————-
Total 107%
Of course, the democratic parties HAVE to nominate a charismatic person to lead.
The predilection for this blog to act an apologist for Gyurcsány is embarrassing. You seem to be arguing that on coming to power, he was justified in running the country into the ground for reasons of political expediency (Ms Balogh has said on several times that she doesn’t blame him). And yet you are quite content (rightfully) to slag off Fidesz for doing the same. The Öszödi beszéd was an admission that that was what he did, and that it was wrong, and yes, that was admirable. Except it was not an admission made to the electorate but to his own party. Had he said all this publicly, had he actually resigned after the speech was leaked with a good farewell address (and Ms Balogh is correct that he is by far the most able person in Hungarian politics to give a good speech), then I think he could be regarded more favourably. But he didn’t. He chose to carry on and looking back, that was morally wrong.
Don’t fool yourselves: there is no electorate in any normal country that would have accepted anything other than resignation following the leaking of that speech. And my friends are largely liberals, many with Jewish backgrounds (given this tends to be brought up again and again) and most of them were spitting spiders about Gyurcsány and many still are.
He was a talented man but he proved out of his depth at running both the MSZP and the country, and he needs to disappear.
Re HiBoM. The wonderful thing about democracy that we can both express our opinions.
A cautionary tale:
Back some years ago I met a 70-something older gentleman of Russian extraction. He told me that Russian corruption-style of pervasive corruption–will infect the world. It seems to be coming true: as is plainly evident, Orban is the foremost student of Putin-KGB style of operating. As an example, backtrack to the UEFA selection of locales for the soccer World Cup for 2018 and 2022. Putin, who was instrumental in having Russia selected for the 2014 Winter Olympics said that he wouldn’t go to Geneva (?) to face the selection committee because he didn’t think that Russia had a chance. He did, however, send Abramovitz and his retinue. Ahh, the magic of Mr. A.–
Surpise of surprises, Russia won the right to hold the 2018 World Cup; but that was nothing to jaw-dropping surprise of the US which lost out to….Qatar (!!!) for the 2022 Cup. Honest Mr. Blatter must’ve been in a giving mood: a twofer, no less. The grapevine had the tally at 20 million euros.
So you see, the world being what it is nowadays, a few millions of euros in private pockets will dent the armor of the hardiest ethicals.
I think that wily, old Russian knew a thing or two…
I think this is correct. At most, this group of people won’t go out to vote at all.
Yes, yes. But think of all the benefits.
– The national holiday declared in celebration of the wedding.
– The billions of people watching the wedding live all around the world.
– The enormous spike in tourism.
– The incredible ‘feel-good’ factor that will wash over Hungary.
– The boost to the economy of all the commemorative Rahel & Istvan tea towels, plates and mugs.
These things will happen, right?
Eva: “I think that if you asked Bajnai his honest opinion it would be very close to that of Gyurcsány. The rest? It’s a mess. Milla with its fuzzy politics by the people directly: citizens order and politicians deliver. PM belonged to LMP which has very far to the left and have naive ideas about “green politics.” So, in my opinion it is mess.”
But this mess plus the common scepticism about “politicians, parties and politics in general” is what we have got now. No matter how bright the members of DK are, if they want democracy they have to bring their message home to exactly those people with “messy” and sceptical views of politics. Ferenc Gyurcsany already led the country, and failed. And if it were for nothing else, his stubborn insistence on being right and not seeing the strategical faults in his approach, has alienated people. To the extent that it is not easy to imagine that he could lead a united Hungary back to Europe. Ferenc Gyurcsany would have to be able to take a back seat, instead he and his DK are currently acting as if they were the only bright ones and the only people next to OV who understand political strategy. When I read that he is the only one who can match OV in political skills, I wonder what the whole thing is about. About two egos fighting it out? The whole nation could easily use their political “skills” and challenge OV by marching in the streets. Currently Hungary needs people who are able to unite the nation and define a common goal, not a battle between people who are unable to take a back seat when necessary. And also: Perhaps the most loyal Fidesz voters cannot be won over but the group of dissatisfied people is large enough and these could be decisive – if taken seriously, offered an alternative and not being insulted for having “messy” ideas.
Don’t be afraid of the loonies. The future PM will able to manage them. It’s OK to have incompetent subordinates as long as you can use them and they follow. The problem is the guys with egos, like Gyurcsany. How do you hire people? Use anything and anybody to get votes and seats in the parliament.
By the way if I were the DK top brass, I would have dropped Gyurcsany and started the negotiations lead by Vadai. And why not – the boys may offer the PMship to Lady Agnes. That would prove that the left is not about positions.
Not to mention the drastic drop in the wild dog population of the area…
You and I know this but, I don’t need to know it ‘cos I don’t get to vote. The people that do get to vote seem to view Gy as part of the problem and not part of the solution. As disappointed as people are with OV (and everyone I talk to is very disappointed with Fidesz) they still will not vote for Gy. As things stand at the moment, I wouldn’t be surprised if the next elections have the lowest turn out ever as people are so disillusioned by the poor governance. On top of this most people still don’t get that the media authority is stifling the voice of the opposition.. which IMHO maybe doing the opposition a favour given how weak they currently are.