Serious questions about Fidesz’s election results

The first foreign media reactions to the results of the Hungarian election were anything but enthusiastic, but now that the dust has settled and there has been time to take a look at the figures, it is dawning on journalists and analysts that these “fantastic” results were achieved in a highly dubious manner. Even the raw figures give food for thought. How is it possible to achieve a two-thirds parliamentary majority with less than 44% of the votes? And then there is the disturbing statistic that among voters outside of Hungary’s borders 95% opted for Fidesz. Pictures showed vote collecting in street stalls in Transylvania, the source of most of the votes, with no attempt to even feign secret balloting. The ease with which these new citizens could cast their ballots as opposed to the difficulties expats in the United States, Canada, Australia, and western Europe encountered when they tried to register and actually vote makes critics question the intentions of the government. The final verdict most likely will be that Fidesz won this election before a single vote was cast.

Viktor Orbán’s team designed an electoral system that pretty well guaranteed Fidesz a two-thirds majority, which ensures that Viktor Orbán can rule Hungary, with the help of his 133-135 minions in parliament, as a prime minister of unlimited power. A Russian journalist, Leonid Bershidsky, who works for Bloomberg, called Orbán’s Hungary “the European Union’s only dictatorship,” and he compared Orbán to Vladimir Putin and Tayyip Erdoğan. One could argue that it is incorrect to describe Viktor Orbán as “a ruler exercising absolute power without the free consent of the people” because after all he won two elections. Moreover, he is “restricted by a constitution, laws, recognized opposition.” But, given the two-thirds majority, any law can be changed. And indeed laws were changed to fit the needs of the government all through the last four years. As we know, the constitution was also changed several times, and there is nothing to prevent Orbán’s parliament from changing it again. As for the consent of the people, well, one could argue that point, especially if we look at the 2014 election. Because although it is true that Fidesz won the 2010 election fair and square, we cannot say the same about this past election. Finally, a dictator according to the dictionary definition rules without an opposition. Well, in our case there is an opposition in the sense that there are a few dozen people who can make speeches in parliament, but they are unable to make a difference. Orbán’s team can forge ahead without any effective parliamentary opposition. For the time being, the majority of judges still come out with some surprisingly fair decisions, but Orbán already managed to get his own men on an enlarged constitutional court and tried to decapitate the judiciary by sending seasoned judges into retirement at the age of 62. The system that was introduced resembles the political setup of the Horthy regime (1920-1944) which Orbán, it seems, finds attractive.

Perhaps Leonid Bershidsky’s description is too strong, although he knows Putin’s Russia quite well, but other West European journalists also find the Hungarian situation serious. For example, Cathrin Kahlweit, writing for Süddeutsche Zeitung (Munich), talks of Orbán’s laying down “the foundations for a permanent one-party government” achieved by “the declaration of a permanent revolution.” And these journalists call attention to the dangers this new breed of populists pose to the European Union. In Austria, Wolfgang Müller-Funk, professor of cultural studies at the Institute of European and Comparative Linguistics and Literature at the University of Vienna, calls Orbán’s system “Führer-Demokratie,” which is a threat to Europe. MDR, a radio and television station from Leipzig, called Orbán “a political predator” and compared him to Silvio Berlusconi and Vladimir Putin.

Viktor Orbán at one of his press conferences in Brussels / Photo: dpa

Viktor Orbán at one of his press conferences in Brussels / Photo: dpa

Let’s see  what Freedom House had to say about “the state of democracy in Hungary.” According to its report, “the changes initiated by Fidesz contributed to an outcome that was both less than fair and of benefit to Fidesz, as critics predicted. Indeed, Hungarian analysts suggest that without the electoral revisions, the party would have lost the supermajority it has enjoyed since 2010.” And Freedom House’s report didn’t even mention one of the most unfair features of the new Hungarian electoral law, the so-called “reform of the compensation list.” András Jámbor, a communications expert, wrote a piece for Al-Jazeera in which he described the system as one “where votes for individual candidates who did not win their electorate were transferred to their party list, originally designed to amass votes received by runners-up in districts – have now also allowed district winners (in most cases Fidesz candidates) to add their surplus votes to party lists, widening the gap between winners and their contenders, and bringing seven more seats for Fidesz.” 

The Freedom House report also called attention to the far too cozy relationship between Vladimir Putin and Viktor Orbán. “It’s worth noting that the Hungarian election coincided with one of the most serious foreign policy crises faced by Europe since the Cold War’s end: Russia’s invasion of Ukraine and seizure of Crimea. On this critical issue, Orbán has had surprisingly little to say. He and his foreign ministry have issued anodyne statements of mild criticism for Russia’s action, questioned the sanctions imposed by the United States and Europe, and made reassuring declarations about the safety of ethnic Hungarians living in Ukraine’s Transcarpathia region.” The author of the article, Arch Puddington, vice-president for research, finds this attitude especially incongruous given Orbán’s anti-communist stand in the past. Moreover, he was until recently an outspoken critic of Putin’s authoritarian regime. He concludes that “Fidesz’s policies, both at home and abroad, are far from reassuring.”

It is likely that the combined effect of this questionable election and Orbán’s new pro-Russian policy will have a negative effect on his already strained relations with the United States and the European Union and will lead to the further isolation of Hungary in the community of western democracies. But Orbán doesn’t fret about isolation–at least as long as the EU money keeps flowing. As Jonathan Swift wrote (and Orbán’s quote-happy speechwriters might consider including at the appropriate time),“When a great genius appears in the world you may know him by this sign; that the dunces are all in confederacy against him.”

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90 comments

  1. tappanch :

    The Election Commission or Office (and other people, not me) discovered a mathematical error, an overcounting (what a surprise!) in the previous Fidesz compensation vote number.

    After correcting the error, Fidesz has 232.48 seats. Here goes the 2/3?

    I don’t want to sound too cynical but is it possible that error is not really an error?

  2. tappanch :
    The error was 13,437 compensation votes in Fidesz’s favor.
    954,322 old number
    940,885 new number.

    Why didn’t you tell me earlier, read my comment 42. I was already asking you about the d’Hondt matrix. I got excited that you know some breaking news and I already calculated how many votes were needed to switch the seat and it was over 37 000.

    Too bad you thought some type of fraction rounding was involved which I tried to explain also. The d’Hondt matrix is used in the past 25 years to calculate the seats for the national list so I’m surprised you didn’t know about it. Guess it is rarely relevant and in the past it was only used for the national lists. Under the previous system the county lists were more important anyway.

  3. tarnoki :

    “How is it possible to achieve a two-thirds parliamentary majority with less than 44% of the votes?”

    First of all, you used false data for the election results, so that’s one thing that is part of the explanation. Far from being “under 44%”, the actual, real result was 2 264 730 votes for Fidesz, 45,04 % of the total. It helps to find explanations if the data are grounded in reality.

    When I wrote my piece the foreign votes were not counted yet. Moreover, I don’t consider the votes from Romania and Serbia really legitimate. Those people have no stake in Fidesz’s continued rule. They voted for them because of their gratitude. The poor souls refuse to recognize that Fidesz’s motives have more to do with their own political gain than with their concern for their compatriots’ well being.

    By the way, it is so typical that you immediately jump to the conclusion that the data is falsified. Not wrong figures but false figures. This habit tells a lot about the Hungarian right.

  4. They used every trick they could possibly think up. BUT: even without the tricky part, they would have won these elections by a simple majority. This is the most painful lesson of these elections for me.

  5. I have serious doubts about the discussion on the basis for forming a new opposition. Attacking Fidesz for its corruption, anti-Semitism, anti-EU positions, deals with Russians, and the adoption of laws antithetical to the promotion of democracy clearly doesn’t work. Ultimately Hungarians are interested in economic survival.

    If nationalizations can reduce some costs to the population over the short term they should not be opposed even in the long term within the context of a world market such nationalizations can not be sustained. The Russian deal should be looked at contextually and the fears of Russian occupation need to be exploited in the most crude manner, including bringing up the rape of thousands of Hungarian women by Red Army troops after the fall of Budapest. The opposition needs to become far more opportunist and less moralistic if it wants to make political inroads against Fidesz. The opposition needs to create a youth culture that is directly confrontational to the Jobbik/militia culture, which is easier said than done. Don’t many of us have young relatives who participate in this fascist culuture?

    The opposition needs to attack the moral depravity of teenage prostitution in Hungary along with other aspects of organized crime in Hungary and link it where it can to the Jobbik/Fidesz. If the opposition has links to the perverse culture of criminality those involved need to be purged and publicly denounced. That criminality includes the culture of money laundering and tax evasion which is extensive in Hungary. The entire circus around the Grand Prix, crime so often occur in scams, such as currency counterfeiting, when travelers use taxis, being overcharged at restaurants and clubs that there is little question it is done with police support.

    The attack should not focus individually on the 1.2 million Hungarians who are registered by their employer on the minimum wage and who do work on the side asztal alá. But rather the companies that are promoting this practice which now represents about 17-18 percent of gross domestic product. Pointing at high level corruption does not work politically for the opposition but attacking the perverse culture of corruption which has become accepted as normal may work as a theme, but only if the opposition can purge itself.

  6. Judith :

    They used every trick they could possibly think up. BUT: even without the tricky part, they would have won these elections by a simple majority. This is the most painful lesson of these elections for me.

    Sure, but without the two-thirds it would be an entire different ball game. Moreover, there were so many restrictions on the democratic opposition that it is a miracle that they did as well as they did. And I didn’t say anything yet about the gerrymandering.

    However, it is true that the left couldn’t mobilize its own base. And that was their fault.

  7. tappanch :
    Abraham’s haggling with the Lord:
    A: 50; L: OK
    A: 45; L: OK
    A: 40; L: OK
    A: 30; L: OK
    A: 20; L: OK
    A: 10; L: OK
    A: OK
    Unfortunately, the number was less than 10.

    So it was. So it is.

    Where are the 10 people to vociferously object to:

    –the protective handling of Csatary?
    –the sale of Hungarian dignity in the Azeri affair?
    –the outlandishness of designating the county (in the 21st century) as “Christian Hungary”?
    –the systematic destruction of the rule of law?
    –a Prime Minister who doesn’t keep his word?

    …and on and on.

  8. And,
    where is the general outcry in the media–print, radio, tv–against the Prime Minister’s blatant
    disregard of dignity and decency in the ‘monument affair’?

    –Why aren’t people in the media screaming at the top of their lungs??

  9. Eva S. Balogh :
    Just a little more about Kálnoky. His latest is that he ordered the erection of the German monument to divert attention from the election. I think he is wrong.
    http://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/article126797341/Orban-lenkt-mit-Skandaldenkmal-von-Wahlen-ab.html

    Apparently this opinion appears “logical” to some…

    Questions that immediately come to my mind are: why would the highly successful OV in terms of economic policies (growth resumed!, unemployment down!, utility prices down!, inflation so low!, exchange rate so high!, great friends with Great Russia!, all Hungarians united in gratitude!) need to “divert attention”? From what exactly? (Perhaps: that the whole business in Hungary is very ugly indeed?)
    With people so interested in current affairs, why with such a memorial? Why using public money instead of supporting e.g. the creation of permanent jobs for the erection of memorials that interest nobody except some “intellectuals”? Why provoking “intellectuals” in the first place? Perhaps to prove one’s decidedly unintellectual policies and one’s claim that given the widespread need for the “strong and wise leader” (given the general unsophisticatedness of the “traditional Hungarian mind”)?
    Why should elections to the European parliament, with an expected turnout in Hungary of 15 %, be a test of anything with respect to OV? He is critical of the EU anyway, does not follow its rules, does not share its values, does ask his subjects to do the same, why should he need to “divert attention”? People will not go to vote because they know that “Brussels” means “dictatorship”, and that the home grown one is far superior.
    And also: if the opposition tries to debate with the public the pressing issues of “unemployment”, which channels are left for them to do so? State TV and radio with country-wide coverage? Has LMP gained its main support in the rural areas where work by the opposition is the easiest? Have they offered their voters, potential and actual, answers to their most pressing question of “unemployment”?

    Such arguments are close to incomprehensible. Either I am asked to believe that Hungarians support OV no matter what he does because he is the “strong leader” and people unable or disinterested to decide for themselves, next time it is the “inaptness” of the discredited opposition (all Communists) that explains it all, then it is that people who let their “strong leader” apply any nationalist and revisionist argument when confronted with opposition – which is allegedly also the basis of his success (he outwits them permanently! wow!) – are most interested in “current affairs”. This is all quite self-serving. And it is very unfortunate that Mr Kalnoky can with these articles also influence the assessment of some readers of Die Welt.

  10. @Eva:”Sure, but without the two-thirds it would be an entire different ball game.”

    I think we can safely say that if Fidesz gets 2/3, it won’t be legit with all the machinations going on with these elections.

    They abused their 2/3 in the first cycle to secure 2/3 in the second with questionable legitimacy. If they won fair and square, without all the machinations, they wouldn’t have the supermajority, that is clear…. but would have more legitimacy.

    It’ like cheating on an exam to get an A even though you could have gotten an A- easily. Your A is still invalid (based on cheating), although you could have legitimately earned an A-.

  11. OT
    Actually this is letter should be attached to the previous blog entry but I do not want to get lost. As you can remember our Fidesz friend Johnny Boy tried to discredit the poem Eva brought attention to (old poem he said) “You should be treated according to your vote!” Today there is open letter to Viktor Orban from an old teacher. It is of course in Hungarian but if you understand Hungarian, you must read this (especially Johnny Boy, Kovach, Simon should read it).
    http://www.13keruleti-hirhatar.hu/hirek/egy-tanar-levele-orban-viktorhoz

  12. According to Transparency International the Fidesz spent twice as much campaign money as legally allowed. (The calculation is based on the official cost of advertising and media space on various portals where the advertisements were featured)

    So now we know that Fidesz
    – spent twice as much as allowed on campaign spending
    – they mislead the voters lying that they are not affiliated with various civic organizations, even though they were financing each other
    – not all voters were “created” equal, and different voters wet allowed t cast their votes in different ways
    – the privacy of voting was compromised at many instances
    – many legitimate voters were not allowed to vote
    – voters were turned away at voting locations
    – some home addresses had dozens of citizens with foreign permanent addresses registered as residence
    – some people were able to vote more than once as the new election law left a loophole for nomadic voters
    – Fidesz allowed fake parties to register that clearly were stealing the votes from legitimate voters.

    Now how free and fair such election is? (I was not free to vote, as I did not receive my voting card, so please do not ell me it was a free election!)

  13. Let’s go to the heart of the matter.

    Adam Michnik is a Polish historian, essayist, former dissident, public intellectual, and the editor-in-chief of Poland’s largest newspaper Gazeta Wyborcza. Brought up in a family of convinced communists, Michnik was one of the most relentless opponents of the communist regime.

    He tells it spot on.

    “Nowadays there are two dangers facing the protection of freedom of speech and human rights”.
    Creepy Putin and disgusting Orban. Both completely corrupt.
    Both authoritarian sociopaths aiming to rule their countries for the rest of their lives themselves.

    2 years at the most and these creeps will have to face their defeat. Their house of cards which will collapse, like Slobodan Milošević“ empire” did.

    http://www.trouw.nl/tr/nl/30340/Onrust-in-Oekraine/article/detail/3634340/2014/04/12/Terwijl-de-EU-uiteenvalt-sterven-in-Oekraine-burgers-voor-Europese-waarden.dhtml

  14. “Less than 44% of the votes” = more than 45%.
    And how come this results in a 2/3 majority (50% disproportionality)? Because of the large difference between the results of the winner and the runner-up.
    The same way as in 1994 when Horn Gyula and MSZMP got 32% of the votes which resulted in 54% of the parliamentary seats (73% disproportionality).

    I guess you regard the 73% disproportionality as perfectly democratic as opposed to the current 50% which is antidemocratic?

  15. Computational aid:
    45% of votes -> 66.8% of mandates: 67/45 = 1.49
    31.27% of votes -> 54.15% of mandates: 54.15/31.27 = 1.73
    See the math yourself.

  16. petofi :
    And,
    where is the general outcry in the media–print, radio, tv–against the Prime Minister’s blatant
    disregard of dignity and decency in the ‘monument affair’?
    –Why aren’t people in the media screaming at the top of their lungs??

    You see, you may negotiate, even haggle with the Lord, but never with Orbán.
    There is a reason: the reason!
    The good Lord may want to run his(?) business according to the interest of the people in general, Orbán runs his according to his and only his interest, and he does everything to achieve the most. Don’t bother, there is no prayer in existence with any effect to change this – unconditional worship the only accepted way, so we’re out of luck here.

  17. Regarding this shameful election-charade.
    I agree with Minusio, it should have been boycotted, even if the Jobbik and Schiffer would have participated, but if anybody with an ounce of backbone wouldn’t it should have sent a strong and unmistakeable message way before it happened.
    Unfortunately now it tastes markedly as sour grape, whatever the truth is.

    Back to the present:
    Actually I don’t mind, that all the servile, slave minded morons praising Orbán, they have every right to do so, good luck and be happy while it last.
    However, please don’t accept any kind of approval, neither from me, nor from any other civilised person around here. You know why?
    We are quite comfortable to use our own head to think, and to make up our mind, to form our own opinion without any approval from our Lord and Sire – we don’t have any.

    In short, if you wanted to have Orbán, now you got it, but take your own responsibility for your decision and whatever comes with it.

    To those, who can;t resist to compare the present Hungarian electoral law with the UK, American or whatever: who cares? Why it would make any difference in Hungary?
    The present Hungarian law unfair and unjust, doesn’t matter if you find another even worse in Angola or Afghanistan, you see, so just as well if you skip these stupid comparisons, will you?
    After all, what good it make if you wind an even more corrupt and spineless turncoat for Prime Minister in some other place, who may even be a greater scum than Orbán?

    Not a thing – we have Orbán, and he is big enough for that, thank you.

    One more remark, to whom trying to explain away the reckless and shameless cheating and gerrymandering by saying, what is so big deal, he should have win anyway.
    While I agree with the last part – he would have win even if he plays fair and square, but he didn’t! He is a cheat, because he couldn’t resist to show up. Such lowlife your beloved PM.

    Another aspect: in case he wouldn’t have supermajority, he would be forced more to play by the rules in the coming years, may not have had full and uncontrolled access to the Russian money what he intended to use to keep up the appearance of functioning economy – which isn’t more than smokescreen and illusion – while putting the country into misery, hopelessly indebting Hungary in Euro, with uncontrollable Forint-value, and keep on restoring the look and feel of the early forties, in the footsteps of the late Regent.

    I wouldn’t forget, though, that one only can go so far, nothing last forever. After all, even his great soul-mate, Nicolae Ceaușescu have met the wrath of his people at the end, after many years in power with cheering crowd and all, there will be awakening, there always is.

  18. Jus one of the usual, instead of “what good it make if you wind” should be “what good it make if you find” – sorry.

  19. Havelaar :

    Let’s go to the heart of the matter.

    Adam Michnik is a Polish historian, essayist, former dissident, public intellectual, and the editor-in-chief of Poland’s largest newspaper Gazeta Wyborcza. Brought up in a family of convinced communists, Michnik was one of the most relentless opponents of the communist regime.

    He tells it spot on.

    These are strong words. With the help of Google I translated the the important sentences concerning Hungary and Orbán:

    “European values ​​are under pressure also in Europe. Take Hungary. This country seems most like Russia. There is an autocrat, Viktor Orban. Everything is in his hands..Democratic institutions exist, but are curbed or not functioning. Just as in Russia. Behold the modern totalitarian state “

  20. I am repeating because you are ignoring, obviously intentionally, the facts:

    “Less than 44% of the votes” = more than 45%.
    And how come this results in a 2/3 majority (50% disproportionality)? Because of the large difference between the results of the winner and the runner-up.
    The same way as in 1994 when Horn Gyula and MSZMP got 32% of the votes which resulted in 54% of the parliamentary seats (73% disproportionality).

    I guess you regard the 73% disproportionality as perfectly democratic as opposed to the current 50% which is antidemocratic?

  21. A Fidesz Troll posting under the false name of “kommentelo” wrote:

    Kim Lane Scheppele :
    if you look only at Fidesz’s popularity among domestic voters only, you will see that Fidesz received 43.55% of the vote, precisely what Eva said.

    You are wrong. Read the post more carefully. This is what “precisely Eva said” :
    “How is it possible to achieve a two-thirds parliamentary majority with less than 44% of the votes?”

    The standard FIdesz FUD: Harp relentlessly on utter trivia (44 vs 43.55), parade falsehoods willy-nilly, and when you run out of generic (anti-leftlib) smears, and if all else fails, try ad-hominem innuendos (doesn’t matter that they’re false, they tar both parties with the same brush). Fidesz never apologizes for — or even admits — false accusations: it just moves on to the next false accusation:

    “kommentelo” :
    Tappanch are you Toth Zoltan?

    Better still, “kommentelo,” are you Kövér László?

  22. (To Jonny Boy) I am repeating because you are ignoring, obviously intentionally, the facts:

    (Regarding the poem Orban sanctioned before his speech at the last Fidesz meeting prior to the election. In this poem they let Hungarians know that if they do not vote for Fidesz they should better prepare themselves for Hell coming in their way. Literally.)

    Some1 :

    Johnny Boy :
    No. This poem is the reaction of the Transylvanian Magyars after Gyurcsány’s betrayal in 2004.

    Wrong. Can you read English Johnny Boy?

    Some1 :
    The poem originally was written for the 2004 referendum. At this time it was recited prior to Orban taking the stage, so there is no way, he did not approve this poem that is simply a warning, a blackmail and a threat in my humble opinion.

    Can you read Hungarian? Visit http://eugen.hupont.hu/79/ahogyan-szavaztal-koczian-rudolf
    “Ahogyan szavaztál…
    (a 2004 december 5-i népszavazásról)
    (kiegészítve 2005. Húsvétján)
    Szerzõ: Kotzián Rudolf”
    At this time it was about the Fidesz, and how Fidesz will punish those who will not vote for them.
    The 2004 referendum fall apart simply because there was not enough people who cared to vote.
    THe 2004 referendum was about the privatization of hospitals, and about the right to citizenship of those people who considered themselves Hungarian nationals but did not live in Hungary.
    Having said that my favourite verse from the same poet, from the same page form the poem, All the Same.
    The same robbing the country,
    Who drove your cattle to the co-operatives!
    THey put all of yours in the common.
    So now they can divide between each other while laughing.
    Read more: http://eugen.hupont.hu/79/ahogyan-szavaztal-koczian-rudolf#ixzz2ydVYfJtv
    Do you think he wore this poem about Fidesz? Orban and Kover served the MSZP, they came to power and took away all the tobacco shops, then divided all amongst their friends. THey took the retirement savings, and spent the money bailing out the country. THey took the lands and gave otto their friends. THis poem is actually very relevant!

  23. tappanch :
    A fake party defeated the last vestiges of democracy.
    What is Együtt 2014?

    I asked in an earlier posting about Összefogás I have to admit that at the time I was confused. It took a bit to realize what was going on. It’s unbelievable as this was a clear attempt to confuse the public. All I can say that with the time I’ve spend dealing with patent and trade mark lawyers it’s unbelievable that Együtt and Összefogás had/have no recourse against the blatant attempts to confuse. All I can say is that if I tried to register a company named OTP Exchange or Spar Catering I’d have lawyers all over me faster than I could whistle dixie.

    Democracy, R.I.P.

  24. THe Kuria, former supreme court today fined the makers of a piece of political satyre, in which an ape talks in Orban’s voice.

    Let me quote verbatim from the ruling:

    “Magyarországon a majommal való azonosítás azt eredményezi, hogy az állat leképeződött negatív tulajdonságai a jelöltekhez kötődnek (negatív kampány), miközben a kampányoló jelölt humán formában jelenik meg. A Kúria álláspontja szerint ez a negatív kampánynak olyan meg nem engedhető formája, mellyel szemben az érintett nem érvelhet, nem bizonyíthat”.

    So Orban appears in a human form, and it is forbidden to ridicule him with an animal, because
    1. he cannot prove that he is not an animal.
    2. the campaigning candidate [Orban] might not be a human.

    Does the Kuria think that Mr Orban is a
    1. animal or
    2. God?

    http://www.lb.hu/hu/valhat/kvki3744120142-szamu-hatarozat

  25. I am going to repeat the facts as long as you are ignoring them:

    “Less than 44% of the votes” = more than 45%.
    And how come this results in a 2/3 majority (50% disproportionality)? Because of the large difference between the results of the winner and the runner-up.
    The same way as in 1994 when Horn Gyula and MSZMP got 32% of the votes which resulted in 54% of the parliamentary seats (73% disproportionality).

    I guess you regard the 73% disproportionality as perfectly democratic as opposed to the current 50% which is antidemocratic?

  26. The Orban=Monkey satire lost in court is shocking. I though they will loose but not because Orban could be mistaken with a monkey but because they used his voice. This is so ridiculous.

    Did the kuria has anything to say about Orban’s clown ads? I guess maybe it is clear that the members of the oppositions have nothing to do with clowns.

    Can please someone translate the lekepezodott to English as I have no idea.

    I guess in the opposition case
    No one would think “that the identifying with he clown would cause that the character’s degraded[?] negative attributions attach itself to the candidates.”

    While in Orban’s case
    People would think “that the identifying with the monkey would cause that the animal’s degraded[?] negative attributions attach itself to Orban.

    I get it. Makes sense!

  27. Johnny Boy, I am going to repeat the facts as long as you are ignoring them or until you are around. Read comment #24 that proves that you tried to misled the public.

  28. Johnny Boy’s kindergarten logic is really annoying! The other guy did something similar bad – so why am I being punished?

    Nobody says that the 1994 election results were “good” or democratic compared to the 2014 results!

    And our new “one trick pony” trolls are almost funny comparing Hungary’s young unfinished democracy to the UK or the US. Most European countries have a kind of proportional parliament election system with party lists, like Germany, Austria etc where parliament would look totally different from what is happening in Budapest right now.

  29. Johnny Boy :
    And how come this results in a 2/3 majority (50% disproportionality)? Because of the large difference between the results of the winner and the runner-up.
    The same way as in 1994 when Horn Gyula and MSZMP got 32% of the votes which resulted in 54% of the parliamentary seats (73% disproportionality).

    Not the same thing at all. For stability purposes, ‘majority bonuses’ are not uncommon in parliamentary democracies. The first party or alliance, even if they didn’t rally 50% of the votes, may be granted an absolute majority in seats so they can govern without having to negociate post-election combinazioni (often fragile, and which weren’t submitted to public approval during the campaign).

    Nowhere but in Orbánistan does such a bonus result in a supermajority allowing the leading party to rule the land without the opposition’s checking and involvement. To paraphrase a famous quote: democracy is not two wolves and a lamb deciding what’s for dinner tonight.

  30. wolfi :
    And our new “one trick pony” trolls are almost funny comparing Hungary’s young unfinished democracy to the UK or the US. Most European countries have a kind of proportional parliament election system with party lists, like Germany, Austria etc where parliament would look totally different from what is happening in Budapest right now.

    I would add that even France, where a historical fear of government paralysis resulted in a strongly majoritarian system, has evolved over the last 25 years towards more checks and balances involving the opposition – not less.

  31. Eva S. Balogh :

    Judith :
    They used every trick they could possibly think up. BUT: even without the tricky part, they would have won these elections by a simple majority. This is the most painful lesson of these elections for me.

    Sure, but without the two-thirds it would be an entire different ball game. Moreover, there were so many restrictions on the democratic opposition that it is a miracle that they did as well as they did. And I didn’t say anything yet about the gerrymandering.
    However, it is true that the left couldn’t mobilize its own base. And that was their fault.

    Fully agree with you both.

  32. Some1 :
    Johnny Boy, I am going to repeat the facts as long as you are ignoring them or until you are around. Read comment #24 that proves that you tried to misled the public.

    That offtopic and utter nonsense rambling has absolutely no answer to my math.

  33. Marcel Dé (@MarcelD10) :

    Johnny Boy :
    And how come this results in a 2/3 majority (50% disproportionality)? Because of the large difference between the results of the winner and the runner-up.
    The same way as in 1994 when Horn Gyula and MSZMP got 32% of the votes which resulted in 54% of the parliamentary seats (73% disproportionality).

    Not the same thing at all. For stability purposes, ‘majority bonuses’ are not uncommon in parliamentary democracies. The first party or alliance, even if they didn’t rally 50% of the votes, may be granted an absolute majority in seats so they can govern without having to negociate post-election combinazioni (often fragile, and which weren’t submitted to public approval during the campaign).
    Nowhere but in Orbánistan does such a bonus result in a supermajority allowing the leading party to rule the land without the opposition’s checking and involvement. To paraphrase a famous quote: democracy is not two wolves and a lamb deciding what’s for dinner tonight.

    Wrong. It is exactly the same because it is the same thing causing both: mathematics.

  34. @Johnny Boy: You are comparing apples and oranges. The 1994 elections had two rounds. MSzP received 31.27% of the votes in the first round and then 45.16% of the votes in the second round …. and that translated to 54.15% of the parliamentary seats.

    The elections in 2014 had only one round, so you cannot compare the two by arbitrary picking the results of the first round in 1994. This is highly manipulative what you are doing here.

  35. Johnny Boy :

    Some1 :
    Johnny Boy, I am going to repeat the facts as long as you are ignoring them or until you are around. Read comment #24 that proves that you tried to misled the public.

    That offtopic and utter nonsense rambling has absolutely no answer to my math.

    It does.It has a lot to do with you. It has a lot to do with a previous topic, where you stated some nonsense and when we proved you wrongs you tried to misled the public, you did not reply. You were holding out to new blog entries, so you could avoid the truth, an an admission that you were wrong.
    THe point is Johnny Boy that you push people to reply to your comments while regularly avoid to answer to posts that discredit 90 % of your statements or offensive comments, like calling people “low lives” and taking offence that someone calls you a scum for calling them low life. Saying that a poem has nothing to do with something, while it is clearly proven that it was in fact recited at an event (regardless when it was written).
    Dismissing things saying that it has nothing to do with current posts, when in fact it does, as it is about your character and about the ruth of many of your posts.
    Denial Johnny Boy does not equate to truth.

  36. @Minusio:

    Sometimes it can be fun, especially when you know it hurts them – and their masters too …

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