This morning I decided to write more about the “interesting coincidence” that Ferenc Szabó (Feri the Blond), who was convicted for murder and spent ten years in jail, is employed by the Ferencvárosi Futball Club. This fan club is headed by Gábor Kubatov, Fidesz party manager, who is now in the process of organizing a party militia “to defend” Fidesz from future aggressors. Feri the Blond and some of his ilk already showed up at the Fidesz party headquarters ready to remove the “aggressors,” if necessary by force.
As I was gathering material for today’s post I discovered that “the game of the year”–as a Fradi fan called it–was scheduled to take place this afternoon. It is a “derby” between Ferencváros and Újpest, whose fans are deadly enemies of one another. For those of you who are unfamiliar with the term, any match between teams from the same city is called a derby. As I just learned, Ferencváros won, but even before the game started the fans of Újpest attacked the police with stones and broken glass. In turn, a couple of people were arrested for hidden weapons and firecrackers.
This, however, is most likely not the end of the story. Because, as one of the Fradi hooligans told a reporter, “they hunt the enemy.” They plot their route to the stadium in order to avoid the police and to attack the fans of the other team. It doesn’t seem to matter whether they win or lose; the important thing is to have a fight. There is so much aggression in them that they literally want to kill members of the other side. One of the “leaders” of the fans was quite frank: “We are different from others because of the immeasurable hatred in our blood.” The interviews on the following video provide a glimpse into the mindset of these people:
But let’s get back to Ferenc Szabó (Feri the Blond) and Gábor Kubatov. What is the connection over and above the fact that Kubatov is now the boss at Ferencváros and Szabó, the coordinator between the Fradi Security and Kubatov? After all, appointing a murderer to be part of the Fradi security forces would have been far too daring. According to rumors Szabó is getting a better than average salary of 400,000 a month. In June 2012 an article appeared on fradimob.hu in which the author called Szabó “Kubatov’s favorite murderer.” Szabó and Kubatov were soul mates in the notorious Section #2 of the Ferencváros Stadium where the worst hooligans gathered and from where they usually attacked the players, the coaches, or the police. Another member of the group was György Szilágyi (Sziszi), who today is a Jobbik member of parliament. It was this Section #2 that Viktor Orbán decided to visit only a few days before the same hooligans attacked the public television station on September 18, 2006.
These guys were no ordinary football hooligans but members of the underworld: extortionists, blackmailers, drug dealers, and yes, murderers. Not all of them were so unfortunate as to be caught like Feri the Blond. Some of the murders took place in broad daylight in downtown Budapest and the perpetrators were never discovered. This is the world Feri the Blond is coming from.
In August 2012 an article appeared in HVG about another member of Section # 2 who ended up in the Fidesz government. He is Bánk Levente Boros, a “political scientist” at Miskolc University, who in his spare time was deputy chairman of the Ferencváros Szurkolók Szövetsége (Association of Ferencváros Fans). His advice doesn’t come cheap: 400,000 forints a month.
Members of these football fan clubs are getting more and more involved in politics. In Debrecen the members of the fan club of the local DVSC (Debreceni Vasutas Sport Club), better known as Loki, an abbreviated version of the word “locomotive,” entered the building of the university and insulted and intimidated the students. In Budapest at the Faculty of Arts of ELTE the same thing happened. Skinheads decided to “defend” the government. And now Kubatov is calling on his “favorite murderer” to police Fidesz and government buildings.
Several articles appeared on the subject from which I learned a lot. Perhaps the most informative on the connection between Fidesz and the underworld was the blog of “Csehszlovák Kém.” He is the blogger who first reported on the Israeli-Hungarian “friendly match” that eventually resulted in severe punishment of the Hungarian Football Association for not being able or not being willing to keep order among the fans in Hungarian stadiums. For the details see my post, “A friendly football match: Hungary-Israel 1-1.” Another article that appeared on the subject is by László Bartus in the Amerikai-Magyar Népszava (March 10, 2013).
Finally, Vera Lánczos in a piece on Galamus entitled “Báránybőrbe bújtatott farkasok” (Wolves in sheep’s clothing) approaches her subject from more of a political angle. She is convinced that Fidesz ordered the police to withdraw in order to avoid a situation similar to the events of 2006 when the police had to handle the unruly demonstrators. They wanted to show the world that “their” police are not brutal as allegedly the socialist police were. So, instead, they got the football hooligans to do the dirty work. But they had to pretend that these people were “volunteers” worried about the fate of their party. According to Lánczos, the original plan of the protesters was to stay in the courtyard overnight, but when the murderer and his friends arrived they decided to leave on their own because “they feared for their safety.” As it was, the employees of the party headquarters not only insulted the students but used force against them. See the description of an eyewitness quoted by Some1 in her comment of August 22, at 12:02.
Kubatov’s early connection with the hardcore Fradi fans lends credence to the possible connection between Fidesz and the Fradi football hooligans in the storming of the television station in September 2006. Perhaps one day we will know exactly what happened, but I must say that in light of these latest developments one has the feeling that Fidesz involvement is more than likely.
As in all of Orban’s doings there is injected an element of doubt so as to confuse investigation: it can be reasonably assumed that, as in the case of the Jobbik politician, there is overlap between Jobbik, the Garda, and the Fradi gang. Since they all receive their marching orders from the same source, they can be used interchangeably and denial finger-pointing among the triumvirate will be the norm. The police will inevitably throw their hands in the air and declare the case(s) unsolvable.
These are the norms of supra legal states run along the tribal lines of criminal behavior.
Look at how they hate each other, despise each others guts, Újpest vs Ferencváros, now imagine if these united against the “common enemy” (we all know who I mean). It is harder and more dangerous for left wingers in Hungary by the day.
I think it might not be clear in the last but one paragraph, re Vera Lánczos’ article (for those who cannot read the Hungarian article) that the paragraph is about the recent takover of the Fidesz HQ by peaceful demonstrators. The HQ was defended by such Fradi clud people (essentially muscles up gang members).
Fidesz essentially took over the management of these so-called “football supporter/fan groups” (szurkolói csoportok). It’s really a win-win for both sides. There are young hardcore fans who are happy to serve in a hierarchical organisation (what is essentialy a gang) and are very happy to feel the most powerful party behind them.
It gives them a kind of local authority and freedom to act, because smaller deeds (beating up someone) could be ‘dealt with’ at the police after a couple of phone calls.
At the same time, Fidesz has a willing and enthusiatsic corps of agressive thugs who can be used for various purposes.
Also a guy like Feri the Blond, could never in his life get a real job anywhere. He was sentenced to 14 years in a high security jail (fegyház) for murdering his employer (who himself was a criminal), the two other co-defenders got life in prison. Feri got out of jail after 10 years and is likely still on probation. But given the salary which, if true, is significantly above not only average Hungarian salaries, but those of mid-ranking government employees. he is absolutey, posivtively loyal to Kubatov. I suspect that he is not the only fomer convict who are employed by Fradi and other companies linked to Fradi (the club by the way is a huge receiver of taxpayers money, as was mentioned ‘football is a national issue’, so probably more money is spent on club Fradi alone, than on many country colleges).
Gábor Kubatov is the head of Fidesz’ formidable (the best in Hungary) get out the vote organsiation (there are several other posts in the campaign organisation, but he is the real head) and manager of the voters’ data base. He reports directly to Orbán and is otherwise outside the normal Fidesz hierarchy.
I think it would be very interesting to get a better idea about the level of education, and about their average taxable incomes. I think I have a very good idea. THe sad part is that without proper education and without hope for better paying jobs, this where many Hungarians will end up. THis is their “free entertainment”, and their only hope to feel worthy and powerful, insulting and assaulting each other. If they get paid for this directly or indirectly is even better. In Naples there are similar problems. There is no work, living conditions for many are awful, the education level is low, and young kids are happy to get a job from whomever. You should all watch the movie, Gommorah, directed by Matteo Garrone.
The Obama administration recognizes the Iranian government as legitimate, although there was massive fraud penetrated at the 2009 election. [They seem to agree in Iran’s production of nuclear weapons as well]
Will they recognize Orban if he cheats in 2014? Orban must think so.
The manic-depressive lives for the excitement of being on the edge: he figures to push the boundaries until the threats against him–from either Brussels or the US–become serious. Then, in his best obsequious, Felcsutian, manner, he’ll back off. Interestingly, it’ll be the obverse of what he declared once (“Watch what I do not what I say.”) Privately, it’ll be a degree of groveling and promising and claiming that HIS way of dissimulation is the only way to keep the extremists of Jobbik at bay. Necessarily, he can only make these promises privately…
I do not believe you are correct regarding the Obama’s administration stance on Iran.
“”The president of the United States cannot and does not bluff. President Barack Obama is not bluffing,” he told the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC) in a speech to its annual policy conference.
“We’re not looking for war. We’re ready to negotiate peacefully . But all options including military force are on the table,” said Biden.”
Regarding recognizing the Iranian government, the Obama administration is taking a pragmatic approach to Iran. They hope to deal with the nuclear issue diplomatically before using a military option. Seems like a prudent approach to me.
Regarding what the administration would do if there was strong evidence that Fidesz fraudulently won the election – I think they would follow the European Unions cue. If the EU does not act, why would anyone expect the US to unilaterally act? Hungary has little importance to US foreign affairs.
Until the EU acts forcefully toward OV’s government, I do not think the US’s approach warrants any great criticism. The State Department has made repeated statements criticizing the OV government. Some of these statements have come form the highest levels, as when Hillary Clinton made her visit.
In a real democracy, Fidesz can’t tell the police to go away, and Kubatov can’t ask “volunteers” to “defend” the government. That’s what the police are for.
It is beginning to look like a pitbull fight: you agitate, infuriate some frustrated, aggressive or sick people, and send them off to fight each other. Then sit back, watch and enjoy.
Have you seen the video of the elderly “counter-protestors” of Thursday?
I’m a bit worried that all this deliberately and irresponsibly stirred up hatred will eventually turn the cold civil war of Hungary into a real one.
In the mind of those FIDESZ cronies, the students are plotting bloodshed.
Everything is distorted with this regime:
“The students should be in jail.
The FIDESZ mafiosi should enjoy their wealth.
And Horthy will be the next Santa Claus.”
“I’m a bit worried that all this deliberately and irresponsibly stirred up hatred will eventually turn the cold civil war of Hungary into a real one.”
I can’t really see it ending any other way.
Way OT, but…
Bulgaria regrets failing to save thousands of Jews in WWII
It was an awesome game! Fradi won 2 to 1. IMHO the best part was the first Fradi goal around the 40th minute when, get this, their black player head a great unstoppable solo. Yes, black. His name is Somalia and probably he is their best.
I wonder how these animals, who regularly made the monkey sounds in the past for the colored players of the other teams, process this.
Feri the Blond must be really confused.
Probably he is at Bayer’s house , trying to come up with Plan B.
Re Iran. US has no diplomatic ties with Iran.
The forint versus the euro is at 302.62!!!
Let the games begin… this time Hungary won’t have any credibility with the IMF. Just watch the reactions in the bond markets.
Fidesz is happy with an euro of 325-335, inflation is even desired (plus while the rule of thumb used to be that 1% devaluation results in .5% inflation, this is now more like .33%, so a devaluation from 285 to 325 which is only 14%, will have only cca. 5% inflationary consequence — and the Fidesz would be happy even with 10-15% — of course the fx real estate loans will be converted once and for all).
People much more happily accept price increases (which take place one item at a time, as people actually purchase stuff) then the equivalent sudden decrease in salaries (like a new tax or direct decrease of pensions/disability pensions).
Further nationalisations and price controls in the energy (and other)industries (Orbán has now acess to the cookie jar, he can spend as much currency reserve on purchasing private companies or spend on other items, as he wants) will anyway mask inflation or will give the look of a strong government willing to defend the population against foreign/business interests. While people realise what’s going on (if ever), they will be reelected. Note that Chavez was also reelected while the country’s infrastructure was crumbling etc. (although I guess Chavez was much more likable than Orbán).
So the currency rates are nothing special, part of the plan.
Ex-President and founder of Constitutional Court, Laszlo Solyom, urges President Ader to veto constitutional changes being voted on today.
I do not agree wit that. People on various medications are paying over twice for some drugs then a year ago. Many of the drugs do not have generic replacement, and are from Switzerland or from Germany. We are talking about life saving drugs here, like heart medications, stroke preventatives, cancer drugs, and the list goes on. Some people simply stopped taking their medications as they have to choose between food, heat or drugs. These are not the people who you will see lining up on the streets to protest. Hospitals will be up to capacity very soon. Even in hospitals the doctors are sending out the relatives to purchase the drugs for their loved ones. It is not a coincidence that the Parliament passed a law that they do not provide certain drugs to sick people “just” to prolong their lives. Hungary actually probably the first country that in some ways, with the steps mentioned, nationalized euthanasia.
High school students were arrested for silent protest in front of the parliament and locked up at Gyorskocsi street. The students were protesting against the fourth changes to the “New” Constitution. “Do not sell out your younger selves!” Bravo!!
Some1: Noted, but then you don’t agree with basic rules of politics and economics. I am not saying that many people don’t hate inflation (a lot of them do), I am just saying that on balance the majority would hate a direct, attributable tax much more. A diffuse economic problem like inflation can be blamed by politicians and individuals on various causes.
There is a reason why countries like Italy, Portugal used to devalue their currencies when the domestic salaries (productivity) made exports uncompetitive and have a higher inflation than the core EU, and not simply just decrease salaries with an extra tax. Politically untenable, it’s exactly like the already mentioned frog fable, in small dozes you get used to it and blame the producer and the utility company, a big, sudden dose, and you blame the government.
What do you make of this? The Prime Minister’s Office announced earlier that Viktor Orbán will make a speech before the scheduled agenda. The title of his speech was to be “Magyarország nem hagyja magát” (Hungary will not give in). So, everybody expected him to talk about the amendments to the constitution and his resolve to vote on them. József Tóbiás (MSZP) was ready with his answer entitled “Alkotmányos válság” (Constitutional crisis). But instead Orbán talked about a court decision concerning the lowering of gas and electricity prices. Tóbiás withdrew his scheduled speech and left the chamber. What do you think? What’s going on?
Eva, I think OV decided to get the modifications to the constitution pass without a fiery speech, so that it attracts less media attention. Also, he made the MSzP look stupid, as MSzP left the chambers for the vote, but Orban talked about how he doesn’t understand MSzP, why they are against the reduction of utility costs. He was clearly trying to shift the discourse from the constitution to the utilities issue. I still think the modifications to the constitution will still pass today, quietly… but we’ll see.
As an interested bystander (geographically, at least), I get the feeling things are building up to something in Hungary.
Given recent history, we wouldn’t expect this to amount to anything, just fizzle out as usual. But I don’t think we’ve had a time since 2010 when there’s been quite so much anger and criticism directed at Orbán/Fidesz – and from so many different directions.
Bur, if this is going to amount to something this time, what will it be? Orbán using this restlessness as an excuse to clamp down even more, or the beginnings of civil unrest and violence on the street?
I’m afraid I can’t see a middle course between these two – we are too far along the road to dictatorship, and Orbán has too much to lose. And if trouble does start, with Orbán’s thugs attacking protestors, demonstrators retaliating, riot police intervening, etc, etc, it can only go in one direction. If you want to see how Orbán will react to meaningful grassroots opposition, just have a look at Syria.
I fear it’s going to get a lot, lot worse before it gets any better.
BN 03/11 12:19 *ORBAN: HUNGARY GOVT WILL RESPOND WITH EVEN BIGGER PRICE CUTS
BN 03/11 12:19 *ORBAN: `SCANDALIZED’ BY COURT DECISION ON UTILITY PRICES
BN 03/11 12:18 *ORBAN SAYS WILL FIGHT DECISION IN FAVOR OF ENERGY COS. ON PRICE
BN 03/11 12:18 *HUNGARY PRIME MINISTER ORBAN SPEAKS TO LAWMAKERS IN BUDAPEST
BN 03/11 12:18 *ENERGY COMPANIES PROFITED AT HUNGARIANS’ EXPENSE, ORBAN SAYS
BN 03/11 12:48 *ROGAN: HUNGARY WILL PERSEVERE IN THE FACE OF FOREIGN PRESSURE
BN 03/11 12:48 *ROGAN: ATTACK ON HUNGARY DEMOCRACY LINKED TO UTIL. PRICE CUT
BN 03/11 12:39 *ROGAN: HUNGARY SHLD DEFEND UTILITY PRICE CUTS AGAINST ALL
BN 03/11 12:37 *HUNGARY RULING PARTY LAWMAKER ROGAN SPEAKS IN PARLIAMENT
BN 03/11 12:37 *ROGAN: WHOLE NATION IS IN STANDOFF WITH ENERGY COMPANIES
The above is from Bloombergs, the news service.
The message is clear: the foreigners whining about the constitution are only the people who want to increase energy prices and trump on poor Hungarians. Since Orbán is winning (winning) such foreigners want to use any means necessary to maim our great nations.
Rest assured that the Fidesz and state media, which controls everything in Hungary, will repeat this ad nauseam.
Note also the war-like rhetoric style.
Like “Csapataink harcban állnak” (ie. in 1956 revolution radio speech of Imre Nagy, he said among others that “our troops are currently fighting”).
Off-topic — but only slightly:
It is rather interesting that someone (User:Koertefa) who has been repeatedly deleting my WP additions on the current goings regarding the Constitution of Hungary should elect to challenge me (anonymously) on self-promotion. It is interesting because the only other time I have been challenged for self-promotion (likewise anonymously) was likewise connected with some very unappetizing goings-on in Hungary . I will let readers and wikipedians form their own judgment as to whether my WP entry shows any signs of self-promotion. But here I would just like to point out that were I indeed a WP self-promoter, it is rather mysterious what on earth that would have to do with the additions I have been posting about the Hungarian constitution…
It’s very simple. Orbán took over the discourse swiftly by talking about natural gas prices. End of story.
Most people don’t even know what a constitution is.
So at that very moment MSZP realised that it would be deadly for them to talk about the consitution when the topic is the sacrosanct issue of natural gas prices.
Such a behaviour would have looked for ordinary people as insensitive and very political to be bogged down by such toys for politicians as the constitution; as opposed to Fidesz’s behaviour which finally dealt with issues that really matter for the people.
Bottom line: Constitutions are for the intellectuals and wusses, tough and ruthless action on natural gas prices and multinatinonal corporations are for winners.
Since J. Tóbiás could not say anything positive re the topic (ie. naturaly Tobiás could not say that I will decrease the prices, which is the only politically acceptable context to mention the natural gas prices; well, like Jobbik, he could have said that MSZP wants to decrease prices at least by 30% not by some meagerly 10%) he had to remain silent.
Simple as that.
Hungarian Democracy. RIP.
Constitutional mega-amendment adopted by Fidesz supermajority
BUDAPEST (Reuters) – Hungary’s parliament, dominated by Prime Minister Viktor Orban’s Fidesz party, adopted changes to the country’s constitution on Monday despite warnings from the European Union and the U.S. government that the changes could weaken Hungary’s democracy. The legislation was supported by 265 lawmakers in the 386-seat chamber, with 11 votes against and 33 abstentions.
A demonstration is planned for this evevning to the Sandor Palace (the residence of the president, Jozsef Szajer) to ask him not to sign today’s changes in the constitution.
In response the TEK, Orban’s private armed forces, aka. Anti-Terrorism Unit, closed the public spaces around the palace.
Mutt, it’s János Áder (the pres.).
József Szájer (on paper the husband of Tünde Handó the co-head of the juduciary and solely responsible for all promotions and HR issues within the judiciary) was asked a couple of years ago to relocate to Brussels and he was the one who wrote the original version of the Basic Law on his IPad. He is reputed to be gay, which is OK in Brussels, but which is not perfectly in line with Fidesz/KDNP’ official party line.
In substance, it’s not a big difference. Áder, Szájer, Kövér etc. — it’s about their adult identity, being a true Fidesznik. They will resist any attempt to change them and they all be fiercely loyal till death to Orbán. They have literally nowhere to go without Fidesz (Orbán).
ahh my bad … sorry.
No. Do not put words in my mouth. You said: “People much more happily accept price increases (which take place one item at a time, as people actually purchase stuff) then the equivalent sudden decrease in salaries (like a new tax or direct decrease of pensions/disability pensions).” which I clearly quoted in my reply, stating that “I do not agree with that”. I did not quote any further part of your post, meaning that I am somehow agree.
I do not agree that people in general happier to accept price increases…
I was at the demonstration in front of the Parliament when Fidesz were voting to extinguish democracy, then half of the 400 of us went up to Castle Hill via the Chain Bridge.
Orban’s own bodyguard force (whose numbers were increased to 1,200 recently) and regular police blocked the square in front of the president’s palace. President Ader is in Germany, the demonstration was advertised at that square, but Orban barred the demonstrators from there, another unlawful act.
The number of demonstrators was pitiful, I saw Solidarity banners and a few DK banners, I could not see any MSzP presence.
Most people in this country did not know that a new, de facto one-party tyranny was established today.
SO, they say that the Hungarian protesters are terrorists? I hope everyone remembers Orban speech when he said that he hopes that he does not need to replace “democracy” (as defined by him) with an alternative system. I think he has just done that today. Hungary today became Europe’s North Korea.
How long do we think Hungary will last as member of the EU?
Live link to the protest now: about 110,000 watching.
What’s planned for March 15th? I haven’t seen any events planned. And Szabad Sajto utca and it’s surroundings are a huge fenced-off construction site right now, full of bulldozers.
I did not wait for the new speeches scheduled for 8 PM.
There will be a blizzard on March 15, so I guess not a lot of people will be in the streets apart from the Polish pro-Orban demonstrators, who will be shipped in by train for the day.
But weather can prove me wrong.
The opposition has announced a joint protest on Kalvin square, since the usual place in front of Erzsebet bridge is closed down as you mentioned.
Orban called a court decision today “scandalous and insolent”. With this speech he proved
again that he is a genuine tyrant who does not respect the separation of powers.
@tappanch; You are my hero. Thank you for going out, and thank you for reporting to us!
Fidesz sources told hvg.hu that Ader will sign the “basic law” 2.0, they expect just verbal protests form Barroso. They think he will not use his only weapon, article 7, which would suspend the voting rights of Hungary in the EU.
Thank you for praising me, but we did not have the chance to be the 300 Spartans of Thermopylai: the weather was excellent, and the 265 Persians of Orban’s Parliament occupied the the realm of the Constitution without giving us an opportunity for fight.
I can only second Mutt: Hungarian Democracy RIP.
This is a very sad day.
I can only hope that the day will arrive that those who voted for this sham will be legally held responsible. They are traitors of the nation, and they acted agains their own constitution. It is very clear that these thugs are directly or indirectly benefit from the passing of the amendments. Just like with stolen properties, whoever has been benefiting from the unlawful conduct should repay their gains with interest. This should include the benefits obtained by their friends, families, and descendants.
Orban swore to uphold the constitution in May 2010, and he abolished it in April 2011.
He and his 265 henchmen should be tried for this when they are ousted.
(Even his courtly opposition of two – Pokorny and Angyan voted for the mega-amendment today)
The problem is they want to rule this country for decades.
Áder is in a good position as he can always say that his hands are tied.
He would just love to veto, but he can’t. It’s not easy being a president.
I guess his statement today that he will answer fully to László Sólyom’s article in due course, means that he will sign the amendments and then he will agree in part with Sólyom, mostly not, but say the above, ie. in his interpretation he cannot veto under the Basic Law.
Áder is a part of Orbán’s inner circle, his life has been solely about Fidesz, he has no separate identity outside of the Fidesz’ realm.
Why would anybody expect anything special from him?
There is a reason why he got to be the president and not someone else. He is trusted, and you know exactly that loyalty is paramount. Betrayal isn’t tolerated. That is why they are “successful” (in one meaning of the word) and they know it.
I don’t think he dares to disappoint.
Try to understand that in his circles of 100% loyalists (as mentioned also Pokorni , Ángyán voted for it) there is not anybody who would dissent (you can’t find any, any Fidesznik who would have said the slightest of critical statements) and so people in his family or friends would spit on him if he did not sign and dared to make Orbán’s life more difficult. He does not care if some liberals would hate him for signing, they anyway do.
Get this: Orbán is god, in fact more than god to a lot of people. Áder among them.
These people like Áder, Kövér, Szájer, Pokorni, Rogán etc. invested too much into the Fidesz project from their lives. For them there’s no turning back.
It’s an interesting phenomenon, but that’s how it is in Hungary.
I am always reminded by the last words of Lászkó Rajk, a tough Hungarian commuinst (he was the minister for internal affairs, ie. effectively controlled the feared secret police) who was executed in 1949 during the internal purges.
Seconds before he was hanged he said: “Long live communism.”
Like a lot of people. he could not face the fact that his life was meaningless and that he materially helped a system that, at least as it was realised, was terrible. The middle-aged people around Orbán are in a similar position. Facing your own utter failure is not something people often do.
Orban’s words in a closed meeting of the Fidesz faction before the vote:
“a vonal fel van festve a fára, már csak bele vágni a fejszét.”
The mark is painted on the tree, you just have to cut it with your axe at the mark.
So for him democracy was a tree to fell – what remains is barren land.
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